I'm sure someone has already said it but I'm hoping #15 holds another receiver workout "camp" like last year and tells Veach who he wants. PMII liked Rice last year and it turned out pretty good. Why not do it again. [Reply]
Originally Posted by tmax63:
I'm sure someone has already said it but I'm hoping #15 holds another receiver workout "camp" like last year and tells Veach who he wants. PMII liked Rice last year and it turned out pretty good. Why not do it again.
If not this year, it will be next, that Veach uses one of these "Camp Mahomes" things into a smokescreen that gets folks biting on WRs they weren't looking that hard at.
Because there are some really dumb, lazy front offices in this league. [Reply]
Originally Posted by staylor26:
I also think Ja'Tavion Samders needs to be in the conversation. I think he will be after the combine. Him and Kelce would be ****ing insane, and help keep Kelce fresh.
This of course would have to come with a significant WR signing in free agency.
Not sure we'd need a significant WR signing in that scenario bc Sanders would be a WR here like Kelce.
I would love nothing more than to destroy defenses in 12/13 personnel the way the Patriots did with Gronk/Hernandez.
That's such a difficult offense to defend. God it would be awesome [Reply]
Originally Posted by staylor26:
DJ, what do you think about Sanders at 31/32 if he lights up the combine like people expect?
Presume you mean Ja'Tavion?
Wouldn't be opposed to it. Not sure if he'd be my BPA at the time, but in a thin TE group, he's one of 2 guys that seem to present a possible difference-maker skill-set.
And I think Andy would get a TON of production out of him during that rookie deal.
My question with Sanders is really whether or not we're a year early with him still. Do we NEED to get a guy because he's a turnkey move TE just yet? Because that's still Kelce. Can't we lean more heavily into Gray to take some load off Kelce? And ultimately would a developmental TE like Johnson or Knox be someone who could be turned into a true Kelce replacement in a season or two at the cost of a much later pick?
I'm still not whole-hog on TE and I think LaPorta, who many people cite as a reason we SHOULD'VE gone TE in the first last year, actually shows why we shouldn't. He wouldn't have been that kind of player here this season. Probably not next. But we'd have had to use that sort of capital on him anyway.
Do you get diminishing returns by going earlier than you have to?
Then again, the wall can hit hard. I thought we could afford to wait on a downfield Z like Hyatt because we had MVS for a year and could get that sort of player this season. Then MVS was hot garbage and a rookie with downfield speed might've been nice. Do I think the wall approacheth for Kelce? No, not quite. He'll continue to decline a bit but still be a top 3 TE. Does that truly need a 1st day replacement? Nah, probably not. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
Presume you mean Ja'Tavion?
Wouldn't be opposed to it. Not sure if he'd be my BPA at the time, but in a thin TE group, he's one of 2 guys that seem to present a possible difference-maker skill-set.
And I think Andy would get a TON of production out of him during that rookie deal.
My question with Sanders is really whether or not we're a year early with him still. Do we NEED to get a guy because he's a turnkey move TE just yet? Because that's still Kelce. Can't we lean more heavily into Gray to take some load off Kelce? And ultimately would a developmental TE like Johnson or Knox be someone who could be turned into a true Kelce replacement in a season or two at the cost of a much later pick?
I'm still not whole-hog on TE and I think LaPorta, who many people cite as a reason we SHOULD'VE gone TE in the first last year, actually shows why we shouldn't. He wouldn't have been that kind of player here this season. Probably not next. But we'd have had to use that sort of capital on him anyway.
Do you get diminishing returns by going earlier than you have to?
Then again, the wall can hit hard. I thought we could afford to wait on a downfield Z like Hyatt because we had MVS for a year and could get that sort of player this season. Then MVS was hot garbage and a rookie with downfield speed might've been nice. Do I think the wall approacheth for Kelce? No, not quite. He'll continue to decline a bit but still be a top 3 TE. Does that truly need a 1st day replacement? Nah, probably not.
I agree, and he wouldn't be my first choice, but my thinking is that if the top WRs and DTs are off the board, and there's no LT they love, he might just be BPA. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Couch-Potato:
I'm starting to believe we've got Coleman and Franklin flipped, or at least the league does. Seems like the pros expect Coleman will go #4 and Franklin #5 or #6 WR off the board. I can't quite figure it out, but scouts and draft heads just aren't quite as high on Franklin as we are yet and despite the lack of production routinely take Coleman over Franklin, and even occasionally have him taken in the top 15. Must be his frame, athletic traits, and youth?
I heard Coleman compared to Mike Evans today and thought hmmmmm, isn't that who most of CP has been clambering for all year? You know, that guy with 10 consecutive 1k yard seasons. Turns out he had question marks around his separation coming out of college too.
Their scouting reports sound pretty similar:
Spoiler!
Mike Evans Draft Profile:
Overview
A prep hoopster with shooting-guard size, Evans combined with Johnny Manziel to form one of the most dominant quarterback-receiver connections in the nation the last two seasons. He’s a big, physical, strong-handed, West Coast possession receiver with playmaking ability who projects as a No. 2 in the pros where he will make his money as a chain mover and red-zone target.
Strengths
Outstanding size and length
Functionally strong to power through the jam
Boxes out defenders and is a big red-zone target
Hardwood background is evident -- outstanding leaper with "above-the-rim" skills to go over top of smaller DBs and highpoint throws
Creates late, subtle separation
Tracks and adjusts
Makes contested grabs -- attacks throws and outmuscles defenders in a crowd
Nearly unstoppable executing back-shoulder catches
Strong, reliable hands
Very strong after the catch -- slams into tacklers, is a load to bring down and leans for extra yardage
Productive playmaker -- averaged 20 yards per catch in 2013 and showed up in big games (18-566-5 vs
Alabama and Auburn)
Good blocker
Physically dominant and tough
Will be a 21-year-old rookie
Weaknesses
Monotone mover with pedestrian speed -- cannot separate vertically or pull away from the pack
Unsudden acceleration
Stiff hips
Will have to make a living in traffic at the next level -- will struggle to separate vs
quick-twitch NFL cornerbacks
Did not run a full route tree and could require patience learning the nuances of refined route running
Backyard element to his college success -- must become savvier instead of depending on superior size and improvisational production
Can be hotheaded and lose control of his emotions
Basketball was first love
Keon Coleman's Draft Profile:
Overview
Keon Coleman has positioned himself prominently as one of the top WRs in the 2024 NFL Draft. Standing at 6’4″ and weighing 215 pounds, he boasts a formidable physical presence on the field. His catch mechanics, characterized by an ability to naturally box out defenders and that "alpha" catch-point instinct, set him apart. While his raw athleticism is a sight to behold, Coleman's route running shows areas for growth, notably in footwork. His athletic burst hints at an untapped potential, waiting to be refined and fully realized in the professional league.
Given his blend of raw talent and exhibited skills, many scouts see him as a valuable pick, though he's currently projected to be taken in the 2nd or 3rd [*Bottom of 1st early 2nd] round. This positioning might reflect the few areas he needs to polish, but it also speaks to the depth of talent in the draft.
SCOUTING REPORT: STRENGTHS
Prototype physicality: boasts elite size, frame density, and compact mass; prime athletic build for an NFL WR.
Outstanding acceleration combined with exceptional foot speed and lateral twitch, especially considering his build.
Superb at manipulating DB blind spots; employs efficient diamond releases and robust hand techniques to separate.
Impressive ball skills: pairs elite timing and body control with remarkable strength at the catch point.
Transcendent aerial adjustments: showcases gravity-defying contortions and consistently extends beyond his frame to secure catches.
Threat after the catch: blends explosive agility, contact balance, and physicality to elude and overpower defensive backs.
Distinguished for his proactive alpha mentality; adept at contested catches thanks to a combination of instincts and sheer hand strength.
Multifaceted athlete: showcased his versatility playing basketball under Tom Izzo; brings that multi-sport dynamism to the gridiron.
[*will be 21 years old]
SCOUTING REPORT: WEAKNESSES
Limited sharpness in routes: occasionally lacks the burst and crispness on angled route breaks, affecting his separation from defenders.
Inconsistent run-blocking intensity: despite his physical prowess, needs to bring more aggression and tenacity to his blocking assignments.
Acceleration concerns: might struggle with elite long speed, making it challenging to consistently outpace boundary DBs in deep ball situations.
Technique refinements needed: can improve on his footwork, hip flexibility, and contact balance for more consistent and effective playmaking.
PFF guys seemed a just a tiny bit dismissive of Legette's performance at the Sr Bowl. I got the perception they were saying "he was fine, but he didn't stand out much either." [Reply]
Those are the only WRs I'd consider at our spot in the 1st. If Franklin's within reach, I say go up and get him because he's the best fit for what the Chiefs like to do on offense, but If not, at least one of these guys is going to drop to us at the bottom of the first. Remember that 6 is still the record for the amount of WRs taken in the 1st and there's already 3 names that are dead locks ahead of my list here.
I'd be excited about anyone of these guys! [Reply]
Originally Posted by Couch-Potato:
Franklin,
Coleman,
Thomas Jr,
Legette
Those are the only WRs I'd consider at our spot in the 1st. If Franklin's within reach, I say go up and get him because he's the best fit for what the Chiefs like to do on offense, but If not, at least one of these guys is going to drop to us at the bottom of the first. Remember that 6 is still the record for the amount of WRs taken in the 1st and there's already 3 names that are dead locks ahead of my list here.
I'd be excited about anyone of these guys!
I'll add to this that I've got a growing theory that the 2nd round is where the value will be at WR. Not that we'll wait to pick one there, but hear me out... I forget which draft head said this but he ranked 11 WRS in the top 50 this year, highlighting how good the WR class is. If 6 WRs is the most ever taken in a round, it seems likely that 1 of those WRs in the top 50 would fall to us in the bottom of the 2nd.
Add to the above the price of moving up in the 1st is expensive, and the value for trading down from the 1st into the 2nd (thanks KCrow) isn't there, maybe our best value at WR would be trading up from our 2nd into the middle of the 2nd round so that we can have our pick of one of the remaining 3-4 WRs ranked in the Top 50? Trading up in the 2nd seems to be a lot more equitable. I noted a few teams that moved up 9-12 spots in 2nd for a 3rd when doing some research as a reference.
Seems this has been Veach's strategy for several years, I wonder if I might be on to something here? [Reply]
Originally Posted by duncan_idaho:
Sanders in round 1 or after a small trade back into round 2 wouldn’t be a bad way to approach it if you commit to the 12 set as your base.
If you run 12 as frequently as you have run 11 in the past, I’d look at it no different than committing to a WR instead.
Either way, you’re talking about a starter-level receiving target.
Sanders with the first pick/Roman Wilson with the 3rd would be an intriguing way to attack it,
iMO.
How do you guys feel about Johnny Wilson as a TE at the bottom of the 2nd or in the 3rd round? Andy could move him all over, we could put some weight on him and convert him to Travis's eventual replacement. [Reply]
Originally Posted by RunKC:
Not sure we'd need a significant WR signing in that scenario bc Sanders would be a WR here like Kelce.
I would love nothing more than to destroy defenses in 12/13 personnel the way the Patriots did with Gronk/Hernandez.
That's such a difficult offense to defend. God it would be awesome
Glad to see support for going for a 2TE approach. Gives us a good receiver, and an eventual replacement for Kelce. Depending on who’s available maybe use our number 1 pick on a TE , UNLESS FRANKLIN IS AVAILABLE, and 2 on a WR. I agree it would probably be better value to trade up in round 2 that in round 1.
I don’t understand why there’s a feeling Laporta would not have worked out for KC. He wouldn’t have done as well as he did in Detroit in all likelihood, but would have been a much better receiver option than what we had beyond Rice and Kelce. [Reply]