Because of all the interest in this thread, I've place all of the video content of Patrick Mahomes II's college career, and draft day goodness into a single post that can be found here. Enjoy! [Reply]
Originally Posted by RunKC:
Case Keenum and Jared Goff played the same exact air raid offense in college as Mahomes. They are ballers this year.
Dak, Cam, Big Ben, Marriotta and more recently Watson have looked good and they played in spread offenses.
RGIII was an outlier bc injuries ruined his career and it looks like DeShaun Watson is heading in the same direction.
Injuries sure didn't help RGIII I agree BUT he was eventually exposed once he got healthy.
Very successful QBing in the NFL is a lot like being a wiz at Math. We all knew those kids in school who couldn't get enough challenges at math and just absolutely excelled advancing to every new level, some here on this board I'm sure. Whereas, the rest of us could only absorb so much math and we leveled off and wanted no more. The majority of the QBs in the NFL are of the latter whereas the elites(Brady,Rodgers,Brees,Manning,etc..) are very few who just kept excelling at the QB position.
The formula for being a great NFL QB is not just physical ability but absolute desire to be a "student of the game" with the "smarts" to be that "complete student" as well and then blessed by going to a team that truly knows how to groom a QBOTF. Physical talent, extreme desire to be great, extreme desire to be that complete student of the game and being groomed properly along with high maturity with the ability to lead men and make them believe they can win. Very rare qualities that very few QBs in the NFL have.
With the spread offense dominating college football, the QBs never have to throw a WR open, ever. WRs are always wide open !! That doesn't happen in the NFL unless there is a busted assignment or Tyreek Hill is your WR:-) In the NFL, you have to throw them open in tight windows of anticipation with immense timing and accuracy releasing the ball before the WR breaks.
I assure you Shula has had to dumb down the playbook for Cam because you can clearly see Cam's game has leveled off and he has just said "screw it" I'm just going with my physical ability. And as great as Cam's physical ability is, still it will only take him so far. See the SB against the Donks. Wade Phillips recognized Cam's deficiencies at QB and exposed him big time. And why Cam is soooooooo inconsistent in his play since and still is to this day IMHO.
Dak Prescott remains to be seen BUT without Elliot in the line up even Dak got exposed this past year. Because it is only his 2nd year I think he is under good hands in Garrett getting developed BUT does he have the desire and smarts to keep progressing at being a true " complete student of the game"? We'll find out in due time.
Mariota like Dak is a wait and see as well. I was really expecting a lot more from him and the Titans this year and was surprisingly disappointed. I think Mariota definitely has the physical ability, maturity and desire. What I don't know is how much of the "student of the game" he has grasped and can he go higher with it becoming a "complete student of the game".
Big Ben has already arrived. His problem is the "fire in the belly" is beginning to wane and his over the summer comment about retiring was no joke and a big tell IMHO.
Deshaun Watson is a wait and see. What I thought was really a huge positive sign for him was that he showed excellent "selective amnesia" when he threw his interceptions and didn't let it get him down and competed with a "fire that was a blaze in his belly" and winning most of his contests due to him throwing many TD passes. He is under good care with O'Brien and I see him developing well but who knows if he has the ability to keep advancing to each level of "being a complete student of the game".
Mahomes this Sunday will show IF he truly is grasping the NFL QB position. [Reply]
Originally Posted by RealSNR:
Is your take on his leadership just a feeling? Because based on everything he has ever said to the media, both pre-draft and post-draft, your assessment seems to be pretty inaccurate. All the reports from his college coaches and the staff in Kansas City also should tell you about his incredible work ethic and personality.
And my other issue with your opinion of his leadership skills goes back to your trust in Reid and Dorsey (now Veach). They passed on Geno when they had the #1 overall. They determined like so many other teams that he was a bad teammate and not the kind of guy they wanted longterm at QB. That's when they have the #1 overall pick, too. So why the fuck would they trade UP to grab a guy with the same entitlement issues and bad leadership skills when they wouldn't spend their #1 on a guy with the same issues?
You said you don't know more than Reid and Dorsey, but these are the guys who EXHAUSTIVELY interviewed and got to know Pat Mahomes before drafting him. Do you seriously believe they would take a kid who was incapable of being a good leader? Do you think GMs and coaches from New Orleans, Houston, NYG, and Arizona would also be as interested in Mahomes if he actually had those personality issues?
If it's your gut feeling, then whatever. I guess, sure, you can listen to that voice in the pit of your stomach. I'm just saying that given what we and the Chiefs coaches know now about Pat Mahomes, it may be time to ignore that gut feeling. There's quite a bit of evidence that says Mahomes' behavior around the team and in the locker room is anything BUT that of a silver spooned rich boy who got everything handed to him on a silver platter most of his life from his millionaire dad.
Excellent. Just.
Perfect.
Where in THEE fuck is Tardbob getting this "spoiled rich kid"-horseshit from anyway? All I've ever seen is a kid with high energy, great relation and leadership skills, exceptional, natural talent, and an absolutely unhidden desire to be elite at his craft.
I have a theory.
Would you like to hear it?
Of course:
We're about to witness the equivalent of an old-time religion revival in the form of about several hundred thousand everyday Chiefs fans, who after being conditioned to believe that players like DeBerg and Smith are "great QB's"( you know the type I'm talking about ), are going to be literally tap-dancing to the fucking loony bin, believing that they have in fact acquired "Football Jesus" in the form of Patrick Mahomes II.
Originally Posted by Chiefshrink:
Mahomes is a very mature kid who was raised right and this is no phony put on either. You can tell in his demeanor when he talks to the media and what his teammates have to say about him. The only thing he really has going against him is the fact that no Big 12 QB has ever ripped up the NFL at the QB spot except for RGIII for about 10 minutes only to be exposed the next year once defenses figured him out that he can't read defenses let alone throw into tight windows.
Well that whole Big 12 vacuum is about to be filled !!!:-)
Who have been the big XII NFL prospects at QB out of the NFL?
Vince Young--Was a dual threat QB that busted. Teams were enamored by the national championship game and loved his legs.
Sam Bradford--How would his career have been if he wasn't made of glass and got drafted in a better situation? He was an MVP candidate this year before another injury.
RGIII--Looked like a star in the making before his injury ruined his career.
That's it. The Big XII hasn't really put out any stud QB prospects.
Plus, situation and player makeup dictate rookie QB success more than anything else IMO. I think most stud QB prospects bust because they go to a horrible situation. Would Aaron Rodgers be a HOF QB if he was drafted by the 49ers instead of Alex Smith? Probably not.
Goff was in an Air Raid system like Mahomes. He looked like shit with a shit situation. Amazing how much coaching has made a difference. He looks like a stud in his second year.
Keenum is in a good situation now and he looks great. He also played in an air raid system like Mahomes. [Reply]
Originally Posted by RealSNR:
Is your take on his leadership just a feeling? Because based on everything he has ever said to the media, both pre-draft and post-draft, your assessment seems to be pretty inaccurate. All the reports from his college coaches and the staff in Kansas City also should tell you about his incredible work ethic and personality.
And my other issue with your opinion of his leadership skills goes back to your trust in Reid and Dorsey (now Veach). They passed on Geno when they had the #1 overall. They determined like so many other teams that he was a bad teammate and not the kind of guy they wanted longterm at QB. That's when they have the #1 overall pick, too. So why the **** would they trade UP to grab a guy with the same entitlement issues and bad leadership skills when they wouldn't spend their #1 on a guy with the same issues?
You said you don't know more than Reid and Dorsey, but these are the guys who EXHAUSTIVELY interviewed and got to know Pat Mahomes before drafting him. Do you seriously believe they would take a kid who was incapable of being a good leader? Do you think GMs and coaches from New Orleans, Houston, NYG, and Arizona would also be as interested in Mahomes if he actually had those personality issues?
If it's your gut feeling, then whatever. I guess, sure, you can listen to that voice in the pit of your stomach. I'm just saying that given what we and the Chiefs coaches know now about Pat Mahomes, it may be time to ignore that gut feeling. There's quite a bit of evidence that says Mahomes' behavior around the team and in the locker room is anything BUT that of a silver spooned rich boy who got everything handed to him on a silver platter most of his life from his millionaire dad.
I'm drunk but here it is in a nutshell.... Mahomes was Clark's pick period. He met with him before Dorsey or Reid. He knew his big money daddy from Texas. I have consistently said this was a Clark pick. In fact, I think it has something to do with the weird handshake at the draft and Dorsey's departure. I trust my gut. Mahomes will be a pooper. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Black Bob:
I'm drunk but here it is in a nutshell.... Mahomes was Clark's pick period. He met with him before Dorsey or Reid. He knew his big money daddy from Texas. I have consistently said this was a Clark pick. In fact, I think it has something to do with the weird handshake at the draft and Dorsey's departure. I trust my gut. Mahomes will be a pooper.
Originally Posted by Black Bob:
I'm drunk but here it is in a nutshell.... Mahomes was Clark's pick period. He met with him before Dorsey or Reid. He knew his big money daddy from Texas. I have consistently said this was a Clark pick. In fact, I think it has something to do with the weird handshake at the draft and Dorsey's departure. I trust my gut. Mahomes will be a pooper.
