Because of all the interest in this thread, I've place all of the video content of Patrick Mahomes II's college career, and draft day goodness into a single post that can be found here. Enjoy! [Reply]
Originally Posted by PAChiefsGuy:
Philip Rivers is overrated. He throws too many INTs to considered great IMO... He's above average but nothing more.
He's a hell of a competitor and when he gets hot he is as good as anyone but he takes too many chances which hurts his team in the turnover battle which is a very important stat when it comes to winning and losing games as we all know from the Marty years and more recently I would say from the conservative Alex Smith style of play years.
You look at Brady, sure he throws a bunch of TDs but since he has become an elite QB his INTs are always low. Combine that with BBs defensive genius and the Pats are a top team every year.
Rivers doesn't do his defense any favors when he throws 21 INTs in a season like he did last year, 18 in 2014, 15 in 2012 and 20 in 2011. That's simply too much. He's a good QB but no way is he great. He also (much like Romo) seems to throw INTs at the worst possible time. Not that there ever is a good time to do it.
It depends. If you are throwing 25 TD's to 15 INT's then that is horrible, but if you are scoring points then it's because you are passing a lot and it will be bound to happen.
Drew Brees threw 15 INT's last year, but he also threw 37 TD's and ran for 2 more.
You're doing a good job as a QB when you are scoring almost 3X as much as you are turning the ball over, unless you are not scoring and not turning it over. [Reply]
The best thing that can happen to Mahomes is for Alex to go out there and play the best ball of his career and show Mahomes what it takes to be a pro.
If Pat can adopt part of Alex's headiness, his overall game will be pretty damn deadly. Set up the big play with some Alex ball and the moment the opposing defense tries to cheat up, Mahomes to Hill for the TD.
Originally Posted by RunKC:
It depends. If you are throwing 25 TD's to 15 INT's then that is horrible, but if you are scoring points then it's because you are passing a lot and it will be bound to happen.
Drew Brees threw 15 INT's last year, but he also threw 37 TD's and ran for 2 more.
You're doing a good job as a QB when you are scoring almost 3X as much as you are turning the ball over, unless you are not scoring and not turning it over.
That's a good point. I also think the timing of INTs is huge as well. Brady and Brees generally are not going to throw an INT during clutch time. P Manning in the regular season same thing, playoffs I don't think P Manning was clutch at all. Anyway, Rivers has had his moments but overall I don't think he is clutch. Far too often he throws an INT when the team could take the lead or tie the game etc...
Who can forget when they had us beat on national TV and he fumbled the snap? I mean really, a fumbled snap? Could you imagine Brady doing something like that?
Overall I think Rivers is a good QB but he just doesn't have that, i have no idea what the word is, but whatever it is he just doesn't have it. Brady has it, Montana has it, MJ had it, Big Ben has it etc.. With the game on the line you want it in those guys hands, Rivers not so much.. That's one of the reasons he will never be mentioned among the greats. He'll just be another good QB who put up a bunch of stats and never won a SB.
Still a hell of a QB though and fun to watch at times. Weird throwing motion but he makes it work. Also, when he gets hot there is not much you can do he is as good as anyone. Probably the only bigtime trash talking QB out there as well for whatever that is worth. [Reply]
Originally Posted by RealSNR:
Watson will have a bit of early success I imagine, but teams will figure his shit out very soon. That slow-ass throwing velocity will be his undoing, probably sooner rather than later.
I think Watson has the largest bust potential of the drafted QB's.
1) Played in possibly the easiest offense of the QB's. It was a 1 read and throw offense with NFL talent all around him.
Originally Posted by jaa1025:
I think Watson has the largest bust potential of the drafted QB's.
1) Played in possibly the easiest offense of the QB's. It was a 1 read and throw offense with NFL talent all around him.
2) Can be terribly inaccurate.
That's why people are fucking morons if they think Mahomes has further to go than Watson in terms of learning the ways of the NFL.
Watson on Gruden's QB camp was rather telling. Or maybe it was Steve Mariucci's thing. Don't remember. Those shows are good for usually nothing more than finding out the personality of each QB, but Watson at the whiteboard was fucking hopeless. He's the only QB I've ever seen on those draft shows who couldn't even fucking spit out the playcall. Seriously, he kept forgetting the name of the play. He had to practice like 5 times just to SAY the name of it correctly.
The Texans have a far bigger mess on their hands. If Bill O'Brien wants to start Watson right away, he's going to have to dig out his flag football playbook from elementary school and start there. [Reply]
Originally Posted by RealSNR:
That's why people are ****ing morons if they think Mahomes has further to go than Watson in terms of learning the ways of the NFL.
Watson on Gruden's QB camp was rather telling. Or maybe it was Steve Mariucci's thing. Don't remember. Those shows are good for usually nothing more than finding out the personality of each QB, but Watson at the whiteboard was ****ing hopeless. He's the only QB I've ever seen on those draft shows who couldn't even ****ing spit out the playcall. Seriously, he kept forgetting the name of the play. He had to practice like 5 times just to SAY the name of it correctly.
The Texans have a far bigger mess on their hands. If Bill O'Brien wants to start Watson right away, he's going to have to dig out his flag football playbook from elementary school and start there.
I didn't watch Watson's gruden show. I watched Mahomes' and I came away impressed. This is probably one of the biggest reasons I think he will have success with Reid. That and his dedication to improve his craft. Reportedly, he's already made tremendous strides. [Reply]
Originally Posted by RealSNR:
That's why people are ****ing morons if they think Mahomes has further to go than Watson in terms of learning the ways of the NFL.
Watson on Gruden's QB camp was rather telling. Or maybe it was Steve Mariucci's thing. Don't remember. Those shows are good for usually nothing more than finding out the personality of each QB, but Watson at the whiteboard was ****ing hopeless. He's the only QB I've ever seen on those draft shows who couldn't even ****ing spit out the playcall. Seriously, he kept forgetting the name of the play. He had to practice like 5 times just to SAY the name of it correctly.
The Texans have a far bigger mess on their hands. If Bill O'Brien wants to start Watson right away, he's going to have to dig out his flag football playbook from elementary school and start there.
I've mentioned that i like to watch Mahomes games before going to bed most nights. I should also mention that i also watch Trubisky and Watson games as well, just to keep things in perspective.
I just don't understand the Watson love. His lack of arm strength jumps out at you. I mean, it's really noticeable. Most of the time when someone tells me "x has a weak arm", you'll watch the game and go "meh. It's ok". With Watson it really stands out.
It mostly shows up on his deep passes. He essentially just chucks it as far as he can and whatever happens, happens.
The Texans will be stuck with a short passing game because his downfield accuracy and strength just isn't there.
On top of what SNR mentioned and what i stated above, his frame is so slight. Narrow shoulders. He plays small. He doesn't look like he'd last an NFL season. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Detoxing:
I've mentioned that i like to watch Mahomes games before going to bed most nights. I should also mention that i also watch Trubisky and Watson games as well, just to keep things in perspective.
I just don't understand the Watson love. His lack of arm strength jumps out at you. I mean, it's really noticeable. Most of the time when someone tells me "x has a weak arm", you'll watch the game and go "meh. It's ok". With Watson it really stands out.
It mostly shows up on his deep passes. He essentially just chucks it as far as he can and whatever happens, happens.
The Texans will be stuck with a short passing game because his downfield accuracy and strength just isn't there.
On top of what SNR mentioned and what i stated above, his frame is so slight. Narrow shoulders. He plays small. He doesn't look like he'd last an NFL season.
I agree.
And the guy was clocked at throwing 49 MPH at the combine...which is really, really low. If you look at some of the other QB's (past and present) velocity scores, I feel like this result is a glaring indication that he will bust... I mean, the only other QB that has been somewhat ok that scored as low as him was (drumroll)....Mike Glennon.
Meanwhile, our guy was clocked at 60 MPH...which if I'm not mistaken is (or is close to) a record. [Reply]
Originally Posted by splatbass:
When they have a very complicated offense to learn, and need a lot of work on technique, and at the same time there is a veteran QB that wins a lot of games, then it is the best thing to do.
It doesn't matter at all what other teams do. Not at all. The only thing that matters is what is best for THIS team, and for THIS QB.
And like I have said a bunch of times, no one on this board has any idea what is best for THIS QB. He could be ready game 1. He could be ready game 1 of next season. He could never be ready. Just tired of hearing people claim they know whats best for PM. [Reply]
Originally Posted by jaa1025:
I think Watson has the largest bust potential of the drafted QB's.
1) Played in possibly the easiest offense of the QB's. It was a 1 read and throw offense with NFL talent all around him.
2) Can be terribly inaccurate.
To me Watson is a younger version of Smith. He can run pretty well but has the weak arm that won't stretch the field. He will be easier to defend because he doesn't have the arm strength to reall be a threat down field in tight spaces. Alex has the same problem. [Reply]
