Because of all the interest in this thread, I've place all of the video content of Patrick Mahomes II's college career, and draft day goodness into a single post that can be found here. Enjoy! [Reply]
Originally Posted by KC_Connection:
Huh? I'm responding to the people blasting this guy today as if he was somehow the issue on the roster over the last two seasons (seasons in which the Chiefs won a SB on the toughest playoff run statistically in NFL history and another in which they appeared in a SB after a 15-1 season).
I'm also on record saying he played a shit game on Sunday night and I've said it all along. Where I differ is that I don't believe that's some kind of indictment on his season as a whole or on him as a player going forward.
He's completely fine. Just get him a LT he can trust again and the Chiefs will find their way back here again.
I think the majority of us have implicit faith in Mahomes. The dude is the savior of the Chiefs. Even if he never won another Super Bowl, I will back Mahomes until the day he retires.
But I can also say when he struggles, he's part of the reason for why he struggles. We're all human. The GOATs of every sport had rough patches and had personal things they needed to work on and change as they got older.
Its okay to say Mahomes has things to work on while also being in his corner as an unwavering fan. [Reply]
Originally Posted by siberian khatru:
This has been my biggest beef with the comparisons.
Add to that the latest "Brady never got blown out in a Super Bowl." That is true. But he got blown out in some playoff games, including some in which he had multiple turnovers that contributed to them, that prevented him from GETTING him to a Super Bowl. Mahomes' playoff career SO FAR -- two losses, both in OT.
I honestly forgot HOW BAD he played in some playoff games. Like other worldly bad. [Reply]
Originally Posted by KC_Connection:
Oh, he definitely thinks he's the greatest player ever.
I don’t think he has that mentality. He’s just trying to win games. Failed miserably a couple days ago. Gotta find a way to perform better next year. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Bl00dyBizkitz:
As fans, it’s easy to forget the Divisional and Championship rounds when you're already knocked out. But everyone remembers the Super Bowl.
It’s brutal how Super Bowl losers are treated worse than teams that lost early in the playoffs.
Take the 90s Bills for example. They’re constantly ridiculed and portrayed as the Washington Generals because they lost 4 straight Super Bowls.
But they were also AFC Champions 4 years in a row. Which is an amazing feat in and of itself.
They wouldn’t get nearly as much shit if they had lost two Super Bowls and lost twice in the divisional round during that stretch. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Bl00dyBizkitz:
As fans, its easy to forget the Divisional and Championship rounds when you're already knocked out. But everyone remembers the Super Bowl.
Good example a year ago with the Eagles. They got their asses kicked in the Wild Card round.
Originally Posted by Sassy Squatch:
If there's a WR that falls you absolutely love, I'd take him. Rice on paper should be the guy but he's coming off a serious knee injury and is a fucking dumbass that got himself suspended.
It's actually not all that serious. He tore the LCL, not the ACL. Everything I've seen is that he won't suffer any long term effects [Reply]
Originally Posted by Red Dawg:
The media is full on stupid and totally hating on Mahomes. Mahomes is being graded on style points 10 years before his care is over. He can still pass Brady. Just because he didn't 3peat is meaningless. Brady didn't either. The loss was ugly but it's still counts as only one loss. It's not 5 because of how it looked.
If Mahomes went back to back again that's 5 and two times back to back. Don't tell me that's not GOAT!
Dee Ford did more damage to the Mahomes GOAT argument than this game. But unfortunately, because of that loss, for most people Mahomes would need to get minimum 6 Super Bowls to be in the conversation. A lot of people would start the conversation at 7 because of that 0-2 vs Brady.
The damage this game did is that it’s another bad Super Bowl performance, and the chances he matches Brady took a big hit. So for now the GOAT talk will rightfully have to be put on hold for a while. Many will even keep Montana above him. Nothing but time can get him back into the GOAT conversation. [Reply]
Originally Posted by crayzkirk:
I was going to stay away for my own sanity yet here I am...
Frankly, I'm tired of the whole GOAT conversation. How about we enjoy what is happening now and let history decide whom is the best? The eye test shows me that PM15 > TB12 at everything other than having a stacked roster and playing for half of his market value.
That said, this was one of Mahomes and Reids worst games ever. Against TB, the Chiefs had nothing they could do because they didn't have the players. Against Philly, the Chiefs didn't try anything different.
Say that he's distracted with family and 3-peat and whatever you want. PM15 was just bad.
The Mahomes we saw in the TB Super Bowl actually keeps us in this most recent one. The offense was bad every where this time. Reid included. When they got the ball back late in the first half and plowed into the line two straight times (presumably after reading Chiefs fans begging for Hunt/Pacheco that clearly wouldn’t work) I knew they were out of ideas and the game was over. [Reply]
Originally Posted by comochiefsfan:
It’s brutal how Super Bowl losers are treated worse than teams that lost early in the playoffs.
Take the 90s Bills for example. They’re constantly ridiculed and portrayed as the Washington Generals because they lost 4 straight Super Bowls.
But they were also AFC Champions 4 years in a row. Which is an amazing feat in and of itself.
They wouldn’t get nearly as much shit if they had lost two Super Bowls and lost twice in the divisional round during that stretch.
Yep, it’s very stupid. Jim Kelly’s Buffalo teams showed a lot of resilience and courage to keep winning conference titles despite the Super Bowl losses. A lot of teams fall apart after one Super Bowl loss, never mind two in a row.
Earliest Playoff loss for Mahomes is Overtime of the Conference Title game. That is 7 straight years of really deep runs in the Playoffs. Very hard to do that. They’ve found a way to be a Top 4 team every year regardless of adversity. [Reply]
Here’s some reassurance for those who are doubting Mahomes being the next goat.
I know everyone has pointed out that Brady was 3-2 in his first 5 Super Bowls, at age 34. That he went 10 years between wins 3 and 4 (age 37). From 2005 through 2013: 9-8 playoff record, two SB losses to those Giants, 32 TD-19 INT, missed playoffs once, first round exit twice.
Tom Brady won a championship in 2018 with Trent Brown, a cast-off RT who was forced to start at LT after their presumed starter was injured and lost for the season in camp. He had Marcus Cannon, past his prime and never very good to begin with, at RT. His IOL was Andrews, Mason and Thuney -- a good IOL, but not great. He was throwing to a washed Edelman, Gronk on his way out of the league and Josh Gordon. None of them had more than 850 yards receiving.
In 2015 he threw for 4700 yards and a 36/7 TD/INT ratio with Sebastian Volmer and a pile of scraps at LT along with 3 rookies on his interior line and that very same pretty average Marcus Cannon at RT. He was throwing to Gronk, Edelman (who missed about half the season) Danny Amendola and Brandon LaFell.
I've spent decades watching Brady, Manning and Montana MAKE their offensive linemen. And they never did that by running around with their hair on fire -- they did it by running the offense on time. All too often, Mahomes doesn't. That's when he gets in trouble. He was at his best THIS season when he was just working the offense and getting the ball out on time.
I just can't get over the deep shot he pulled down Sunday. A high/low, 2-man route combination designed to create a look that depended entirely what the safety does. He looked right at the play. He saw the safety sink on the 'low' with Kelce. He had Worthy even with Mitchell knowing full well how fast Worthy is.
The play did exactly what it was designed to do. And he just wouldn't throw the ball.
It was over right then. I mean it was over BEFORE then, but that was the moment that it was clear that he just wasn't sharp.
And as he demonstrated against Pittsburgh and Houston and even Buffalo - the rest of this is bullshit. I said it BEFORE the Buffalo game that the guy we start at OT barely even matters -- what matters is that Mahomes comes out confident and decisive. When he does, the rest of it takes care of itself. When he doesn't, all hell breaks loose and every weakness we have on the roster is exacerbated. When he's good, the offense is good. When he's bad, it isn't.
The problem with the Chiefs offense, for 2 seasons now, has been the consistency or lack thereof of Patrick Mahomes.
He's still incredibly young in QB years. And he's been under STUPID amounts of pressure. I understand why some of these things happen with him.
But if he has a 3rd straight year of it...well, he's a pretty big part of that throughput. And "He doesn't trust X" is just ridiculous at this point. The Mount Rushmore QBs were asked to find the trust and figure it out. And Mahomes BELONGS on that Mount Rushmore -- so why shouldn't we expect him to build that trust? We've seen lesser talents than him do it with worse weapons. Or with equally bad OL.
I don't give a shit where he stands in relation to Lamar or Allen or whatever. He's an historic tier guy and that's the standard he should be held to. And those guys? They figured it out.
Well said. People here get very defensive when Mahomes gets criticized. The excuse makers are the same fans who if they were fans of other teams would be out there arguing Allen or Lamar are actually better QBs to protect those guys from earned criticism. [Reply]
