Because of all the interest in this thread, I've place all of the video content of Patrick Mahomes II's college career, and draft day goodness into a single post that can be found here. Enjoy! [Reply]
Originally Posted by carcosa:
There is at least one Cavs Finals team that would have been in the lottery without LeBron. MJ was beyond great but he never singlehandedly dragged a dog shit roster to the Finals
Lebron's choke job against the Mavs completely destroys this dumb narrative.
Dude had Wade playing like a Finals MVP and absolutely choked.
Nobody gives a fuck about taking garbage Cavs teams to the Finals in a pathetic Eastern conference. [Reply]
Originally Posted by staylor26:
You don't have to point to his Finals record to make the point that if he were as great as his Stan's want you to believe, he'd have more rings.
Not really my point.
It’s just that a lot of people point to his Finals record and say he lost in the Finals too many times. Well, one way to avoid that is to not drag pretty average teams to the Finals against the Pop Spurs or KD Warriors. Just lose before then.
Same deal with Mahomes. People will point to the losses in the postseason against Brady. We all know that Brady could never drag a Sutton defense to within a coin flip of the Super Bowl. Brady might have died on the field if he played against the Bucs pass rush with that OL Mahomes had in that Super Bowl. [Reply]
Originally Posted by smithandrew051:
Not really my point.
It’s just that a lot of people point to his Finals record and say he lost in the Finals too many times. Well, one way to avoid that is to not drag pretty average teams to the Finals against the Pop Spurs or KD Warriors. Just lose before then.
Same deal with Mahomes. People will point to the losses in the postseason against Brady. We all know that Brady could never drag a Sutton defense to within a coin flip of the Super Bowl. Brady might have died on the field if he played against the Bucs pass rush with that OL Mahomes had in that Super Bowl.
I understand your point, but when you're comparing him to Michael fucking Jordan, it's relevant.
This isn't football we're talking about, the ultimate team sport. There aren't 21 other starters. A guy like MJ or Lebron has way more of an impact with fewer players and playing both ways. [Reply]
Originally Posted by DRM08:
And the Tuck Rule, which bailed him out on a fumble in the snowy AFC title game against the Raiders. It was a damn fumble and should have been a loss for the Patriots. No other great QB has benefited from this rule on such a big stage. The rule only existed for 14 freaking years. The older guys before Brady never benefited from it. Mahomes and the younger players will never benefit from it.
And how about Pete Carroll's brain fart on the goal line? He had the best RB in the league and tried to throw it. Belichick's defense bailed out Brady from another loss.
The Dee Ford game should have been a loss with 3 INT for Brady. But how about Belichick's defense holding the Rams offense to only 3 points in the Super Bowl? That Rams offense averaged 30 points per game in the rest of the season. A total JAG quarterback could have won that game for the Patriots.
Let’s not forget the win that he was handed because of a Wilson INT in the end zone when a handoff to Lynch most likely wins it. [Reply]
Originally Posted by staylor26:
I understand your point, but when you're comparing him to Michael fucking Jordan, it's relevant.
This isn't football we're talking about, the ultimate team sport. There aren't 21 other starters. A guy like MJ or Lebron has way more of an impact with fewer players and playing both ways.
It’s more relevant to point to the total number of championships won than the win/loss record in the championship when comparing the best players of all time though.
For instance, it proves the point better to compare 6 rings vs 4 rings than to compare their records in the Finals. And obviously, that’s ONLY when comparing the best players ever (sorry Robert Horry).
I absolutely agree that MJ has the best total resume of any NBA player, but going 6/6 in the Finals isn’t the reason. While it’s impressive, not making the Finals those other years doesn’t make him more impressive imo. [Reply]
Originally Posted by smithandrew051:
It’s more relevant to point to the total number of championships won than the win/loss record in the championship when comparing the best players of all time though.
For instance, it proves the point better to compare 6 rings vs 4 rings than to compare their records in the Finals. And obviously, that’s ONLY when comparing the best players ever (sorry Robert Horry).
I absolutely agree that MJ has the best total resume of any NBA player, but going 6/6 in the Finals isn’t the reason. While it’s impressive, not making the Finals those other years doesn’t make him more impressive imo.
Originally Posted by staylor26:
Lebron's choke job against the Mavs completely destroys this dumb narrative.
Dude had Wade playing like a Finals MVP and absolutely choked.
Nobody gives a fuck about taking garbage Cavs teams to the Finals in a pathetic Eastern conference.
Credit where credit’s due, that Cavs team that consisted of Lebron, Kyrie, and a bunch of JAGs that beat a loaded Golden State team is the counter to his finals loss to the Mavs. [Reply]
Originally Posted by tredadda:
Let’s not forget the win that he was handed because of a Wilson INT in the end zone when a handoff to Lynch most likely wins it.
Whispers: Brady got absolutely depantsed by Spags in the 07' Super Bowl but escapes blame in spite of having one of the greatest offenses of all time around him. Dude could not recognize a single blitz coming from our balla ass coordinator. [Reply]
Originally Posted by tredadda:
Credit where credit’s due, that Cavs team that consisted of Lebron, Kyrie, and a bunch of JAGs that beat a loaded Golden State team is the counter to his finals loss to the Mavs.
Only if you ignore that that Warriors team was running out of gas and had no business even being in the Finals after the Thunder choked away a 3-1 lead in the WCF.
It was impressive, but that Warriors team had injuries and clearly ran out of gas down the stretch after chasing 73 wins. And you said it yourself, Kyrie was absolutely phenomenal. He played at an MVP level too, and made the big shot. Lebron doesn't get all the credit, but it's definitely his most impressive championship.
It definitely made up for the Mavs choke job partially, but it didn't completely erase that. You could never erase that, especially when you're trying to argue that he's the GOAT over MJ. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Chiefspants: Whispers: Brady got absolutely depantsed by Spags in the 07' Super Bowl but escapes blame in spite of having one of the greatest offenses of all time around him. Dude could not recognize a single blitz coming from our balla ass coordinator.
I think it's just that nobody is going to beat you up for any SB losses after you win 7 :-) [Reply]
Originally Posted by staylor26:
I think it's just that nobody is going to beat you up for any SB losses after you win 7 :-)
I don't argue that at all, it's just in terms of narratives he seems to escape that even compared to someone like Curry (He disappears in the Finals, etc). [Reply]
Originally Posted by staylor26:
I understand your point, but when you're comparing him to Michael ****ing Jordan, it's relevant.
This isn't football we're talking about, the ultimate team sport. There aren't 21 other starters. A guy like MJ or Lebron has way more of an impact with fewer players and playing both ways.
If anyone could ever say they were like MJ it's probably Joe Montana. 4-0 SB record and a 127 rating with 11 TD's and 0 INT's in the SB.
