This thread is a repository for bee keepers or those interested.
A couple of years ago, a couple of friends an my brother started puttering with honey bees. I didn't buy off because, well, I've never been a big fan of bees or getting stung by them. Last summer I tagged along a couple of times to check their hives and to remove honey bees from a house, public building and an old garage.
I realized at the end of the summer when I was helping them process some, that it's actually pretty interesting, and fits into my expanding "grow my own" logic. I'm not full blown hippy but I see a lot of logic in the self sustaining food thing and I'm doing some of that too.
That said, this thread is about bees, honey bees, bee keeping and bee fighting war stories.
I'm taking the leap and plan to get 2-3 hives this spring and maybe build some bee swarm traps to make it cheaper or to make a few bucks.
Join me and I'll share the real life lessons of an ameture bee keeper. I'm sure I'm going to learn some things the hard way.
The tipping point was when, as a kid, I had a bee somehow in my shoe, and under my shirt, at the same time, and was stung by both of them. At that point, it felt personal, and despite not having allergies I've carried an irrational fear and hatred of them all through my life. As such, despite being a man of science who logically understands the important role bees play in nature, if I had the opportunity to wipe out all bees on the planet I'm not sure I could avoid the temptation to push the button.
The reason I'm chiming in here is because I heard some interesting stories recently regarding the alternative, when bees are wiped out. In several areas of China, bees have indeed been driven to extinction. As such, farmers are currently employing what might best be described as "human bees", or manual pollinators. When researching the story, what they found was that the manual pollinators actually did a Better job than bees, and fruit yields in the area were up by 30%. Initially, this also was accompanied by large economic growth due to rising demand for low wage labor.
However, as China has increased in economic prosperity, wage increases have made it so that it's increasingly unprofitable to hire those manual pollinators, causing economic hardship. Where things will go from there remains to be seen, but it's interesting just that humans were able to pick up the slack, and I wonder what tools and automation might be developed were this to become a big problem in the USA.
Regardless, I'm thankful some folk care enough to keep bees around and care for them, even if personally I'll likely kill all the ones I encounter. I won't however poison the land around my home with pesticides and especially not that vile filth Round Up, so I do my part to not drive them to extinction, even if ultimately those who will determine their fate are large agricultural grow operations rather than individuals.
I will toss out as a random final tangent that the label "organic" is meaningless in the vast majority of states, including yours, as it carries no regulatory weight. So if you want to fight back against the poisoning of our soil which is driving bees to extinction in more ways than just beekeeping, don't buy "organic", buy instead that which is specifically and explicitly labelled as "pesticide free", as that actually means something. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Giant Octopodes:
Bees and I don't get along.
The tipping point was when, as a kid, I had a bee somehow in my shoe, and under my shirt, at the same time, and was stung by both of them. At that point, it felt personal, and despite not having allergies I've carried an irrational fear and hatred of them all through my life. As such, despite being a man of science who logically understands the important role bees play in nature, if I had the opportunity to wipe out all bees on the planet I'm not sure I could avoid the temptation to push the button.
The reason I'm chiming in here is because I heard some interesting stories recently regarding the alternative, when bees are wiped out. In several areas of China, bees have indeed been driven to extinction. As such, farmers are currently employing what might best be described as "human bees", or manual pollinators. When researching the story, what they found was that the manual pollinators actually did a Better job than bees, and fruit yields in the area were up by 30%. Initially, this also was accompanied by large economic growth due to rising demand for low wage labor.
However, as China has increased in economic prosperity, wage increases have made it so that it's increasingly unprofitable to hire those manual pollinators, causing economic hardship. Where things will go from there remains to be seen, but it's interesting just that humans were able to pick up the slack, and I wonder what tools and automation might be developed were this to become a big problem in the USA.
Regardless, I'm thankful some folk care enough to keep bees around and care for them, even if personally I'll likely kill all the ones I encounter. I won't however poison the land around my home with pesticides and especially not that vile filth Round Up, so I do my part to not drive them to extinction, even if ultimately those who will determine their fate are large agricultural grow operations rather than individuals.
I will toss out as a random final tangent that the label "organic" is meaningless in the vast majority of states, including yours, as it carries no regulatory weight. So if you want to fight back against the poisoning of our soil which is driving bees to extinction in more ways than just beekeeping, don't buy "organic", buy instead that which is specifically and explicitly labelled as "pesticide free", as that actually means something.
I think you could have just kept all this to yourself instead of posting it in a pretty cool thread. I for one am rooting for the shoe and shirt lurking bees after reading it. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Giant Octopodes:
Bees and I don't get along.
The tipping point was when, as a kid, I had a bee somehow in my shoe, and under my shirt, at the same time, and was stung by both of them. At that point, it felt personal, and despite not having allergies I've carried an irrational fear and hatred of them all through my life. As such, despite being a man of science who logically understands the important role bees play in nature, if I had the opportunity to wipe out all bees on the planet I'm not sure I could avoid the temptation to push the button.
The reason I'm chiming in here is because I heard some interesting stories recently regarding the alternative, when bees are wiped out. In several areas of China, bees have indeed been driven to extinction. As such, farmers are currently employing what might best be described as "human bees", or manual pollinators. When researching the story, what they found was that the manual pollinators actually did a Better job than bees, and fruit yields in the area were up by 30%. Initially, this also was accompanied by large economic growth due to rising demand for low wage labor.
However, as China has increased in economic prosperity, wage increases have made it so that it's increasingly unprofitable to hire those manual pollinators, causing economic hardship. Where things will go from there remains to be seen, but it's interesting just that humans were able to pick up the slack, and I wonder what tools and automation might be developed were this to become a big problem in the USA.
Regardless, I'm thankful some folk care enough to keep bees around and care for them, even if personally I'll likely kill all the ones I encounter. I won't however poison the land around my home with pesticides and especially not that vile filth Round Up, so I do my part to not drive them to extinction, even if ultimately those who will determine their fate are large agricultural grow operations rather than individuals.
I will toss out as a random final tangent that the label "organic" is meaningless in the vast majority of states, including yours, as it carries no regulatory weight. So if you want to fight back against the poisoning of our soil which is driving bees to extinction in more ways than just beekeeping, don't buy "organic", buy instead that which is specifically and explicitly labelled as "pesticide free", as that actually means something.
Fact check: Round Up isn't a pesticide. :-) [Reply]
Originally Posted by patteeu:
Fact check: Round Up isn't a pesticide. :-)
The active ingredient in Round Up is Glyphosate. In addition to killing weeds (intentional), and its likely carcinogenic properties (probably unintentional), it has been demonstrably linked to bee deaths (maybe unintentional). Just search "Glyphosate Bee deaths" and you can find your pick of article or study around it, it's well established at this point.
As the definition of a pesticide is "a substance or agent used to kill pests", I'd argue that even if that is not its Intended or primary purpose, it certainly qualifies as one, depending on whether or not one views bees as a pest :-)
However I'm not trying to argue semantics, which is why I listed it as a separate and standalone entry next to pesticides. That being said, you do raise a valid point in that depending on how it's legally classified, unless food is labelled as "herbicide and pesticide free" rather than just "pesticide free", it may still contain RoundUp, something I hadn't previously considered. More reason for diligence in knowing what food you're buying and consuming, I suppose.
Also in case it wasn't clear, I will restate- I love the fact that some folks are beekeepers, and think it's very important for the reasons I previously stated. So my primary purpose was just to say keep up the good work, congrats on you, even if it'll never be for me, the future could be very dark and complicated if bees fade away. [Reply]
I tried an experimental setup in most of my supers this year: 8 frames in a 10 frame box.
The idea is the bees will build out the frames more to fill the open space. More honeycomb=more honey. For the most part it worked. I had some monster frames of honey that would barely fit in my extractor. I think I'll try 9 in a 10 next year.
I got some wild looking comb that was great for doing chunk comb honey, a first for me.
Originally Posted by Groves:
Roundup may be used as a herbicide, but let’s not pretend it’s harmless when ingested by bees or animals.
We only keep bees so our family has good lead-free honey not from China. We sell our surplus to locals. Only had 35lbs or so to sell. Gone in a day.
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1) Those jars are indeed very pretty, and very nice composition and lighting in this and some of your other shots. Do you do photography on the side as well?
2) When you say "Only had 35lbs to sell", is that an implication 35lbs is unusually light, or are you just saying you have a small operation for personal consumption? If the former, what's a normal harvest? Regardless, what time period of harvesting does that represent? A month? A year? Or do you irregularly harvest based on personal need so it varies too much to meaningfully say? [Reply]
Originally Posted by Giant Octopodes:
The active ingredient in Round Up is Glyphosate. In addition to killing weeds (intentional), and its likely carcinogenic properties (probably unintentional), it has been demonstrably linked to bee deaths (maybe unintentional). Just search "Glyphosate Bee deaths" and you can find your pick of article or study around it, it's well established at this point.
As the definition of a pesticide is "a substance or agent used to kill pests", I'd argue that even if that is not its Intended or primary purpose, it certainly qualifies as one, depending on whether or not one views bees as a pest :-)
However I'm not trying to argue semantics, which is why I listed it as a separate and standalone entry next to pesticides. That being said, you do raise a valid point in that depending on how it's legally classified, unless food is labelled as "herbicide and pesticide free" rather than just "pesticide free", it may still contain RoundUp, something I hadn't previously considered. More reason for diligence in knowing what food you're buying and consuming, I suppose.
Also in case it wasn't clear, I will restate- I love the fact that some folks are beekeepers, and think it's very important for the reasons I previously stated. So my primary purpose was just to say keep up the good work, congrats on you, even if it'll never be for me, the future could be very dark and complicated if bees fade away.
You should start a I hate bees thread and leave this one for beekeeping and people interested in reading about it. Just a suggestion. [Reply]
Originally Posted by srvy:
You should start a I hate bees thread and leave this one for beekeeping and people interested in reading about it. Just a suggestion.
I replied to someone who responded to me, with information pertaining to two of the primary reasons beekeeping as a hobby has been growing in popularity- the real and perceived threat to the health of bee populations and its potential economic and ecological impact, and secondarily as a source of honey, in an era where people are more concerned about the source and safety of their food than they previously were. I also included specifically a callout to the fact that I concur with the importance of beekeeping as a hobby or business source and am glad folks are engaged with it.
Remind me again, what exactly did your post contribute to the topic at hand? Maybe just start a "I hate GiantOctopodes" thread and leave this one for beekeeping and people interested in reading about it, just a suggestion.
On topic, for those who do produce and sell honey, what kind of price do you normally sell it for? Has the rising popularity of beekeeping impacted your sell price at all, if you've been doing this for a while? According to the US Department of Commerce the national average price for organic honey has dropped considerably in the past year or so, but that being for national averages it obviously primarily reflects drops in price from large scale operations, and I'm curious if that has also impacted the local market. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Giant Octopodes:
I replied to someone who responded to me, with information pertaining to two of the primary reasons beekeeping as a hobby has been growing in popularity- the real and perceived threat to the health of bee populations and its potential economic and ecological impact, and secondarily as a source of honey, in an era where people are more concerned about the source and safety of their food than they previously were. I also included specifically a callout to the fact that I concur with the importance of beekeeping as a hobby or business source and am glad folks are engaged with it.
Remind me again, what exactly did your post contribute to the topic at hand? Maybe just start a "I hate GiantOctopodes" thread and leave this one for beekeeping and people interested in reading about it, just a suggestion.
On topic, for those who do produce and sell honey, what kind of price do you normally sell it for? Has the rising popularity of beekeeping impacted your sell price at all, if you've been doing this for a while? According to the US Department of Commerce the national average price for organic honey has dropped considerably in the past year or so, but that being for national averages it obviously primarily reflects drops in price from large scale operations, and I'm curious if that has also impacted the local market.
Actually I replied to the wrong quote my beef is with the bee's and I dont get along. Seemed out of place for the topic. [Reply]
I had a very good year of production, but I'm working to double my hives next year with all wild/swarm/cutout colonies.
I've added more sizes to what I sell from 20oz up to 5lb jugs but I'd prefer to sell 12oz all day long. The comb honey has been worth adding to my stable of products but it sold in a flurry and then slowed down. It's not a huge target audience, but I'm doing things like cutting some up and leaving places to share so people that are curious can try it.
I'm going to bottle more of the glass muth jars for the holidays, throw in a sliver of comb and wrap them with some seasonal colors or something so I can upsell to soccer moms wearing the "basic b" outfit.(tall fuzzy boots, stretch pants and a long sweater)
Also of note......I've got a daughter that boys have decided may be of dating age, but she's not 27 so they can all F off. The good news is they are from another town and have told her I'm "scary and terrifying". I like that. I Love that.
One in particular has been asking her out....I told her to tell him that he had to take my bravery challenge to prove he's worthy. I said if he sat bare ass on one of my open hives for 30 seconds I'd allow it.
Originally Posted by Giant Octopodes:
1) Those jars are indeed very pretty, and very nice composition and lighting in this and some of your other shots. Do you do photography on the side as well?
2) When you say "Only had 35lbs to sell", is that an implication 35lbs is unusually light, or are you just saying you have a small operation for personal consumption? If the former, what's a normal harvest? Regardless, what time period of harvesting does that represent? A month? A year? Or do you irregularly harvest based on personal need so it varies too much to meaningfully say?
1. Those are Muth jars, based on a late 1800s design. I like em. I definitely do not do photography on the side, but you're very kind to think so.
2. Beekeepers have tended to lump themselves into one of three categories.
Hobbyists: Can have any number of hives, but don't rely on income. They're playing around, even if they're serious. This is me. I have between 1 and 8 hives at any given time, and even though I sell honey, it's not meaningful income. I just like my hobbies to pay for themselves!
Sideliners: These are people for whom beekeeping is a side gig, and quasi their second job. These are the guys still figuring out that a hobby that becomes a job is not as fun.
Professionals: These guys are all in. They make their living with bees. They could rent out their hives to almond or apple orchards, or they could just have a bunch of hives in a bunch of places. All types of people.
I'm definitely a hobbyist, and right now we have two hives. We run smaller hives than most people, so our "boxes" weigh less. My 35 lbs was taken from two boxes, one from each hive. The boxes weigh a bit more, but I do keep some honey. That's what I'm doing all this for. The excess is just a bonus.
A typical langstroth medium honey super might have 30lbs of extractable honey, where mine gave me about 18lbs. My old back appreciates the difference.
It is possible to harvest at many different times of year, but we harvest in the Fall. So that would be per year.
Once I had a hive blow over in February, so we "harvested" that one in February. Likewise I had a hive too small to defend it's considerable honey stores on some warm December days once, and so my boys and I retrieved it at night when the other bees "weren't lookin'!" That was a Dec "harvest" of sorts.
I'm a big fan of freedom, which means I don't care how other people keep their bees. They can use common hives or weird ones. Traditional methods or new-fangled.
We don't treat with chemicals, but plenty of friends do. Their choice. I love this country. Winter is a great time to build a hive. Why not you? [Reply]
The wife has used some to make lip balm, and I decided to make some candles. I bought a morel mushroom mold from Mann-Lake and made these little 1oz candles. They burn for about an hour.
I haven't done anything with wax yet. My plan has been to melt it into toilet paper rolls to make wax "crayons" to apply wax to new frame foundations. I don't know where I saw that but its' something I've considered doing and probably will this winter.
I do like the idea of candles and lip balm maybe to sell some.
Yesterday I snuck off for a while and put in some version of candy boards....I just pressed wet sugar onto wax paper and let it dry. I didn't do any elevated moisture boxes or anything. I did have a couple that were too thick and the top didn't want to shut tight, so I had a little smashing to do.
I also had some thin foam core insulation boards that i cut in half and wrapped around the hives to help them a little with wintering.
I'm hopeful to keep these bees alive and healthy as I like what I have and am planning to do some splits in the spring if they make it.
that's the last task I really plan to do this winter other than I'll feed a little more sugar water if it warms up. [Reply]
