I think we can all agree the offense has not been up to par this season.
At this point, there's only so much we can do about it. Our best WR got injured and is missing the season, our best RB is out until December, our LT situation is messy and our stud TE is looking his age.
So, is this who we are now? Is 30 points a game a distant memory?
What can be done?
(Andy Reid is lurking in this thread, so make sure you're on your best behavior.) [Reply]
Originally Posted by O.city:
Yeah....it's been an issue for a couple years.
It's not a new thing.
He's not comfortable in the pocket and he has 4 high level OL in front of him. I don't really know what else they can do.
Only answer might be to reallocate the big $$$ investment in the offensive line from Thuney's left guard position to a bonafide stud LT, and then try to draft a new left guard (guards are in theory easier to plug and play as rookies than tackles).
It was wrong then. It's wrong now. I mean if we're going with "Rice dropped a lot of passes" it's clear you're just repeating tired old saws that didn't have any more merit then than they do now.
Rice dropped 2 balls in his first 10 games last season. And you're resorting to "He wasn't ready because he dropped a lot of passes..."
Just trying to speak the same old arguments into existence.
No it’s a matter of understanding who Andy is when it comes to rookie WRs and what he will let them do. I was as big of a critic of our WRs last year but was always supportive of Rice.i pushed for rice to increase his role faster because I was so down on everyone else. Realistically Andy is not going to let rookie WRs do too much early even in a desperate situation like last year. We heard this narrative last year about how these WRs were flying open everywhere only to see bad results when we took those shots. Especially with Mvs who presumably is the role we want to replace.
Right now they are asking worthy to run 1/3 go routes and I think something like 20% crossers. Andy is not asking him to do very much and asking him to do something different is asking him to change his dna. Maybe we need to push worthy to do more too soon or mahomes to live with the mistakes that will come of it. But for now we’re either asking Reid to push him more than he’s comfortable with or pushing worthy for something he isn’t ready for, and pushing mahomes to take big risks with a guy he probably doesn’t trust just yet. [Reply]
Originally Posted by FloridaMan88:
Only answer might be to reallocate the big $$$ investment in the offensive line from Thuney's left guard position to a bonafide stud LT, and then try to draft a new left guard (guards are in theory easier to plug and play as rookies than tackles).
Finally fortify Mahomes' blind side at LT.
He drifts backwards when he's not confident in his IOL, though.
I mean we don't want him getting gunshy out there - it's a ticket to nowhere. At the same time, we can't have blue chip OL at every spot on the line.
It's hard to find a better OL than the Chiefs have in the entire NFL right now. And it's not just that OL play league-wide is bad (though it is) -- this line is genuinely excellent.
Reid needs to help the LT out a bit if that's what it takes to get Mahomes comfortable in the pocket. But I don't think reallocating talent from the IOL to the OTs is any sort of panacea either.
Sometimes Mahomes just gets anxious back there. [Reply]
When did it become an issue? Oh golly gee whillikers, it sure seems to coincide with becoming YACtrick Mahomes when Nagy took the reigns at OC. He had absolute shit at both bookend OTs in 2022 throwing to JJSS and MVS and won both MVP awards. Since then he's a shell of his former glory. You might get a gleam or two of old Patrick Mahomes but by and large that dude is MIA currently. [Reply]
Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501:
No it’s a matter of understanding who Andy is when it comes to rookie WRs and what he will let them do. I was as big of a critic of our WRs last year but was always supportive of Rice.i pushed for rice to increase his role faster because I was so down on everyone else. Realistically Andy is not going to let rookie WRs do too much early even in a desperate situation like last year. We heard this narrative last year about how these WRs were flying open everywhere only to see bad results when we took those shots. Especially with Mvs who presumably is the role we want to replace.
Right now they are asking worthy to run 1/3 go routes and I think something like 20% crossers. Andy is not asking him to do very much and asking him to do something different is asking him to change his dna. Maybe we need to push worthy to do more too soon or mahomes to live with the mistakes that will come of it. But for now we’re either asking Reid to push him more than he’s comfortable with or pushing worthy for something he isn’t ready for, and pushing mahomes to take big risks with a guy he probably doesn’t trust just yet.
1/3 go routes and 20% crossers is fine.
That doesn't mean he's an 'unreliable deep threat' - that's a fine use of a guy with his speed.
You just have to be willing to look for him and hit him with the pass when it's there.
To this point we just haven't. And ultimately that's more on Pat than it is Worthy. And if you want to say it's on Reid somehow, I guess you can say that Reid's unwillingness to provide help to the LT has sped Mahomes up a bit.
But the issue isn't the WRs. We have guys in Worthy, Hardman and even Watson that absolutely have the juice to provide viable downfield weapons. And again, if Terry McLaurin can get deep balls, Rashee Rice damn sure can.
Execution has been a bigger problem than personnel. By a LOT. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Sassy Squatch:
When did it become an issue? Oh golly gee whillikers, it sure seems to coincide with becoming YACtrick Mahomes when Nagy took the reigns at OC. He had absolute shit at both bookend OTs in 2022 throwing to JJSS and MVS and won both MVP awards. Since then he's a shell of his former glory. You might get a gleam or two of old Patrick Mahomes but by and large that dude is MIA currently.
The drifting backwards thing pre-dates Nagy. He was doing that under Bieniemy. I believe that was 2021.
EDIT: It's also worth pointing out that his reluctance has come with the improvement in his defense. Some of it probably is a calculated decision on his part to be less risky. The problem is that it's not actually been reflected in his turnovers.
Because in-between the risk-averse decisions not to push the ball, he's making REALLY strange decisions into congested areas.
Because again, he's not playing very well.
Be cautious or be aggressive. But don't vacillate wildly between both and in the process end up with the worst of both worlds.
Originally Posted by RunKC:
Who taught Nagy that? Who ran horizontal stuff all the time in Philly and then in the Alex years when Doug Pederson was OC? All roads lead back to Andy.
Pretty clear it’s a personnel issue that’s also affecting the QB.
Yeah, and he didn't learn a damn thing about in game adjustments or crafting the game plan around his personnel. He either just abandons the concept altogether or jams square pegs into round he les.
Pederson picked up that shit just fine though. He won a Super Bowl by adjusting his scheme to fit Foles strengths while minimizing his weaknesses with the RPO.
Nagy just runs the same shit with no regards to his personnel. Justin Fields, Andy Dalton, Nick Foles, and now Patrick Mahomes. The same ineffective shit. It's fucking painful to watch us deteriorating into a defense oriented team with the best QB talent in history rostered. [Reply]
Like how the #Chiefs overwhelmed their zone here with Worthy running through it and Kelce spacing it out to open up the sitdown for Rashee Rice in between the two zones. pic.twitter.com/VhZDWJnVTd
Originally Posted by dirk digler:
Younger Patrick hits Worthy for the TD.
Like how the #Chiefs overwhelmed their zone here with Worthy running through it and Kelce spacing it out to open up the sitdown for Rashee Rice in between the two zones. pic.twitter.com/VhZDWJnVTd
Because Worthy's not a reliable deep threat so obviously you can't throw a simple skinny post to him against a single high safety with enough open grass to land a 747 in... [Reply]
Mahomes got fooled by a simple disguised look. That was single-high all day with a route that is almost tailor made to kill it. That should've been a 6 but Mahomes saw the 2-high pre-snap and seemingly gave up on it. [Reply]
It became an issue when personnel got weaker. Kelce was still great in 2022 and MVS was at least competent. Juju was very good too.
Both young LT’s got absolutely prison raped in the the last 10 games they’ve played to the point that they weren’t playable, Skyy Moore and old ass Juju with one functioning knee is taking snaps that were meant for Hollywood Brown and now we’re bringing back 29 year old Kareem to go with a FB replacing Pacheco.
And people think it’s not a personnel problem huh? :-) [Reply]
Originally Posted by Sassy Squatch:
When did it become an issue? Oh golly gee whillikers, it sure seems to coincide with becoming YACtrick Mahomes when Nagy took the reigns at OC. He had absolute shit at both bookend OTs in 2022 throwing to JJSS and MVS and won both MVP awards. Since then he's a shell of his former glory. You might get a gleam or two of old Patrick Mahomes but by and large that dude is MIA currently.
Are you going to acknowledge that Nagy was the OC in 2018 when Mahomes threw for 50 TDs and our offense was absolute bonkers? Or does that not fit your narrative of what Nagy is?
I find it extremely hard to believe that guy comes back from Chicago and "turns" Mahomes into a checkdown artist. Nagy knows what Mahomes can do, there's no way he wants this. It's absurd.
