Because of all the interest in this thread, I've place all of the video content of Patrick Mahomes II's college career, and draft day goodness into a single post that can be found here. Enjoy! [Reply]
Originally Posted by ThaVirus:
He has improved his accuracy and processing, but they are still his most glaring weaknesses.
I mean, assuming you guys are correct: he's 6'5" 240, literally perfect size for a QB, strongest arm in the league, runs a 4.6, accurate, and makes quick, efficient reads.. So why isn't this dude better than Mahomes then? He would be the best QB ever if what you guys are saying is true.
If completing 70% of his passes is his "glaring weakness" then that says quit a bit about how good he actually is. [Reply]
Originally Posted by ThaVirus:
I mean, assuming you guys are correct: he's 6'5" 240, literally perfect size for a QB, strongest arm in the league, runs a 4.6, accurate, and makes quick, efficient reads.. So why isn't this dude better than Mahomes then? He would be the best QB ever if what you guys are saying is true.
Because Mahomes is just THAT fucking good. Mahomes has some uncanny clutch magic the likes we've never seen before, possibly in the history of sports.
Mahomes may go down as the greatest pro-athlete of ALL time.
We're discussing Allen's standing as a top 5 QB, not whether or not he's better than Mahomes. [Reply]
Originally Posted by ThaVirus:
He has improved his accuracy and processing, but they are still his most glaring weaknesses.
I mean, assuming you guys are correct: he's 6'5" 240, literally perfect size for a QB, strongest arm in the league, runs a 4.6, accurate, and makes quick, efficient reads.. So why isn't this dude better than Mahomes then? He would be the best QB ever if what you guys are saying is true.
Well we're talking about this because someone ranked Mahomes and Allen 1 / 2 in the NFL.
So if Mahomes is the best player of all time which is possible, Allen being #2 actually perfectly fits what you just described. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Detoxing:
Allen completed passes under duress, i can show you a multitude of them.
And Josh Allen will have a 15 year career at least. The NFL has many, many examples of big QB's who can hang in and take hits.
I don't follow the Bills like that, but i can't think of any games Allen has missed due to injury.
Yes, he has completed some passes under duress, but those are about as common as a quality deep ball from Alex Smith. I'm not saying he's a terrible QB, but there's no way he's top 5. [Reply]
Originally Posted by AdolfOliverBush:
I'm not saying he's a terrible QB, but there's no way he's top 5.
Absolutely top 5.
From an ability perspective? Absolutely.
Top 2 arm, possibly #1. Delivers accurate footballs from anywhere on the field. Has that Mahomes/Rodgers ability to throw an accurate ball regardless of foot/body position. Size and speed to be a legit dual threat QB.
Another season like last season will erase all doubts about his ability.
If Allen is going to have postseason success the Bills have to get better. You can't go into the postseason with only 1 guy who can win 1v1 matchups, a poor defense and no run game and expect to have good results. [Reply]
Top 2 arm, possibly #1. Delivers accurate footballs from anywhere on the field. Has that Mahomes/Rodgers ability to throw an accurate ball regardless of foot/body position. Size and speed to be a legit dual threat QB.
Another season like last season will erase all doubts about his ability.
If Allen is going to have postseason success the Bills have to get better. You can't go into the postseason with only 1 guy who can win 1v1 matchups, a poor defense and no run game and expect to have good results.
No.
He depends on his legs a lot more than Mahomes/Rodgers.
Mahomes is the greatest off-platform thrower the NFL has ever seen.
Allen is a bit better than average now, not special. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Detoxing:
Lol, not bull fucking shit.
You developed this opinion years ago and you, unlike Josh Allen, haven't changed.
It's a thing fans do. Form an opinion, and then stick to it regardless of what's changed.
Josh Allen is an accurate QB.
Look, context matters. Few teams run their system entirely through their QB.
The Chiefs do. So do the Bills. These teams ask their QB's to carry the offense.
The Bills play ENTIRELY though Josh Allen. He has no run game worth speaking of. His defense was historically bad for half of last season, and only became serviceable in the 2nd half of the season.
He has one good receiver in Diggs, and despite that, played outstanding football last season.
The numbers don't support your theories. He was nearly a 70% passer, and he wasn't dinking and dunking down the field.
Bro, did you read my posts? I've been defending Allen. I think he's awesome.
I agree with most of the latter half of your post, except for saying Diggs is their only good receiver. Beasley and John Brown are pretty good for what they are: a slot guy and a speedster.
Originally Posted by ThaVirus:
If last year is any indication on his future, Josh Allen is fucking nasty. He's not on Mahomes' level (and certainly not better than Aaron Rodgers), but he was definitely a top 5 QB last year.
Originally Posted by ThaVirus:
He's like 6'5" 240 or something which is perfect size. His arm is probably stronger than Mahomes'. He can run like a gazelle. Physically speaking, you can't ask for a much better specimen.
If he can continue to work on his accuracy, processing and learning when to slide, he could be elite for a long time.
Originally Posted by ThaVirus:
Yeah, but Josh Allen is clearly a bit further along in the passer progression than Lamar Jackson. Jackson is a running QB, whereas Allen is a QB who can run.
I think that's evident in the eye test, but also statistically as well. Allen just attempted 575 passes last season to Jackson's 375. Even in Jackson's MVP season, he only attempted 401 passes. He's clearly the guy they would prefer to limit his attempts. Allen is not that kind of QB.
I actually had no problem with that. He was young, in his first playoff game, attempting to bring his city its first postseason win in over 2 decades, and just trying to make something happen.
See? I've thought he was really good for a while now.
But you've got the first half all wrong. I'm not the type of guy to form an opinion and not change it if given new information.
I've watched Allen a ton and his accuracy is still questionable. [Reply]
Originally Posted by ThaVirus:
Bro, did you read my posts? I've been defending Allen. I think he's awesome.
I agree with most of the latter half of your post, except for saying Diggs is their only good receiver. Beasley and John Brown are pretty good for what they are: a slot guy and a speedster.
You mean the corpse of John Brown who is now on his 4th team in 4 years.
Beasley is the epitome of average NFL receiver.
Those types of guys are ok during the season, but in the Playoffs, playing playoff defenses, you need better than that.
I mean, lulz, just look at what the Chiefs did to the Bills defensively. That tells you a lot about what teams think of Beasley and Brown. [Reply]
Beasley is really good at getting separation but also he may never play again, the whole city has turned on him for being a moron about vaccinations [Reply]
Originally Posted by Kiimosabi:
Beasley is really good at getting separation but also he may never play again, the whole city has turned on him for being a moron about vaccinations
How is Beasley a Moron? He just wants a choice is all. It shouldn’t be forced against people [Reply]
Stefon Diggs is a stud and is the perfect security blanket for Allen. How many highlight reel catches did Diggs make last season? That doesn't completely negate what Allen is or brings, but it has to be considered. Remember how Tony Gonzalez would make whatever QB was throwing to him look above average to good? Kind of the same thing with Diggs in regards to Allen.
Allen isn't dogshit by any means. I would take him right now over Lamar Jackson, but I feel his ceiling may be Phillip Rivers with less interceptions and more rushing. He and Baker Mayfield might be competing with Justin Herbert for second best AFC QB for the next decade. [Reply]
