- Early career production - Dynamic threat downfield & after the catch - Elite speed & start-stop ability - Fluid mover w/ good route running chops - Ball tracking is A+
Not entirely sure why the vibe isn't higher when talking about him in the WR class. pic.twitter.com/dv3JjdyZgh
I'll write something fresh about Worthy tomorrow morning now that he's a Chief to lay out how he's more than speed, but for now here's an excerpt from article linked in the below tweet... https://t.co/EcW7QtUrFFpic.twitter.com/811ahCEfMS
Originally Posted by Bl00dyBizkitz:
It sounds dumb but I wish I could chain his legs down at the end of his dropback. Just force him to live in the pocket and solve his problems from there without his legs bailing him out.
Like, father time is going to catch him eventually, he's gotta learn to stand in there longer at some point.
Actually felt at times this past month that hanging in the pocket has led to more sacks than it has prevented. I hear your point too, but overall I think his pocket presence - usually his strongest trait - has been poor whether he stays or bails. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Bl00dyBizkitz:
I think last year I got pissed about the nameless D Coordinator calling Mahomes a 1-read QB, but this year its been mostly true? Sometimes he'll get through his reads, other times its 1 read and then bail the pocket, whether there's pressure or not. Protection has been iffy this year, but its not like we have the worst line in the league either, its acceptable. Nothings changed, other than Mahomes being too much in his own head.
Yeah, he's developed some bad habits or leaned into some bad habits over the last couple seasons, imo. And I doubt I discovered anything by thinking that. Pretty sure a ton of analysts, pro and amateur, picked up on it way before I did. And I'm seeing him lock in on a receiver right at the snap and just not look for another option, or flick through a read or two too fast then try to find Travis at the last second, and by then he's way late. Et cetera.
I'm not getting too worked up about it simply because we've seen this before, for several years now, and he always, eventually, gets himself sorted out.
However, I do worry that if we don't fix the protection and the weapons issues, this will become more the norm as the years go by. [Reply]
Originally Posted by pugsnotdrugs19:
Actually felt at times this past month that hanging in the pocket has led to more sacks than it has prevented. I hear your point too, but overall I think his pocket presence - usually his strongest trait - has been poor whether he stays or bails.
There was this stretch from like 2020-2021, especially in the playoffs, where his pocket navigation was immaculate. He wasn't bailing, but he was beginning to do the Manning thing where he perfectly shifts himself to avoid the incoming traffic with eyes downfield, and then he'd rip a throw for a first down. It was glorious.
I haven't seen him do it for quite some time, it's a rarity nowadays if it happens. [Reply]
Originally Posted by pugsnotdrugs19:
Actually felt at times this past month that hanging in the pocket has led to more sacks than it has prevented. I hear your point too, but overall I think his pocket presence - usually his strongest trait - has been poor whether he stays or bails.
Well you still gotta throw it on time.
Before Morris went down, that was the issue. And sometimes over the last couple of weeks. He was standing in the pocket but it looked like he was doing that thing he did early last season where he was locking onto his first read and waiting for him to open up instead of throwing him open or moving to his 2nd read.
Then as the game progressed, he started getting more confident and firing.
Didn't happen that way last week, though... [Reply]
Just look at the aii-22. Worthy is wide and I mean wide open at least 2-3 times a game for a long TD/ Mahomes is looking his way many of those times and just decides to throw underneath.
Since we know Reid has seen the same thing on film. Why are they not insisting Mahomes take the TD shot the defense is giving us? [Reply]
Originally Posted by DJ's left nut:
Well you still gotta throw it on time.
Before Morris went down, that was the issue. And sometimes over the last couple of weeks. He was standing in the pocket but it looked like he was doing that thing he did early last season where he was locking onto his first read and waiting for him to open up instead of throwing him open or moving to his 2nd read.
Then as the game progressed, he started getting more confident and firing.
Didn't happen that way last week, though...
Denver just created too much pressure and not just because of the LT. The interior got mauled too. [Reply]
Originally Posted by BigRedChief:
Just look at the aii-22. Worthy is wide and I mean wide open at least 2-3 times a game for a long TD/ Mahomes is looking his way many of those times and just decides to throw underneath.
Since we know Reid has seen the same thing on film. Why are they not insisting Mahomes take the TD shot the defense is giving us?
You gonna put a shock collar on him during the game?
He's probably taking those shots in practice - we know he was in camp.
He KNOWS it, too. He says as much virtually every post-game presser. He's just not doing it in game situations.
Insist all you want but the bottom line is that he's been playing tight when the game starts. He loosens up a little as the game goes along, especially if he has some early success.
But it seems to me that he's just being really cautious in the first half of these games and then if/when the game stays tight and/or he hasn't had success the time or two he's pushed the ball, he stays tight.
A little more 'fuck it' wouldn't hurt. Especially early in games when there's still plenty of time to right the ship. [Reply]
Originally Posted by Bl00dyBizkitz:
There was this stretch from like 2020-2021, especially in the playoffs, where his pocket navigation was immaculate. He wasn't bailing, but he was beginning to do the Manning thing where he perfectly shifts himself to avoid the incoming traffic with eyes downfield, and then he'd rip a throw for a first down. It was glorious.
I haven't seen him do it for quite some time, it's a rarity nowadays if it happens.
I think last season regressed him with all the drops and picks. I think he's gunshy this season because of it. Simply, he had his receivers drop 44+ passes last year and I forget how many turned into INTs. And that number is a little low, because PFR/ESPN still has Skyy only dropping 2 passes, which is 100% wrong, as we all know.
So, I think Pat's Risk vs. Reward meter is effed up. He's thinking, "the pass has to be dead-nuts perfect for my receivers (other than Travis) or he's going to drop it/cause an INT." So if he doesn't think he can put it right on the $$$, he hesitates. Or he tries to guide the ball, instead of just throwing it. Either way, he's not pulling the trigger on time, or not pulling it at all.
Originally Posted by Megatron96:
I think last season regressed him with all the drops and picks. I think he's gunshy this season because of it. Simply, he had his receivers drop 44+ passes last year and I forget how many turned into INTs. And that number is a little low, because PFR/ESPN still has Skyy only dropping 2 passes, which is 100% wrong, as we all know.
So, I think Pat's Risk vs. Reward meter is effed up. He's thinking, "the pass has to be dead-nuts perfect for my receivers (other than Travis) or he's going to drop it/cause an INT." So if he doesn't think he can put it right on the $$$, he hesitates. Or he tries to guide the ball, instead of just throwing it. Either way, he's not pulling the trigger on time, or not pulling it at all.
Just my opinion.
Dude just refuses to throw it into tight windows now. It's maddening. He has the arm, I doubt he thinks he can't do it, he just won't will himself to do it in game. And in Worthy's case he gets so few shots down field. If he misses the first one, well, pack it up guys, we're not taking any more of those. [Reply]
Watch the first couple years of Mahomes. Dude would just sit in the pocket, dodge the pass rush, and then fire it in there to a WR. He might have been top 3 in navigating the pocket in the history of the NFL. He doesn't ever do that now. He just bails and runs and throws some crazy shit every single time. They need to make him stay in the pocket. [Reply]
Originally Posted by dlphg9:
Watch the first couple years of Mahomes. Dude would just sit in the pocket, dodge the pass rush, and then fire it in there to a WR. He might have been top 3 in navigating the pocket in the history of the NFL. He doesn't ever do that now. He just bails and runs and throws some crazy shit every single time. They need to make him stay in the pocket.
Not really - not his first year as a starter anyway.
I mentioned it when the did a Mahomes-a-thon on NFL Network a few years back. The difference between 2018 to 2019 and then to 2020 was STARK.
Watching those games in 2020 is like watching a completely different guy. The 2018 version was playing with his hair on fire. The 2020 version was the best we got from him, IMO.
I will forever maintain that the 2020 Chiefs were the best team of this entire era. Those OL injuries are just heartbreaking because that team was a buzzsaw and Mahomes was the best he's ever looked. [Reply]
Originally Posted by dlphg9:
Watch the first couple years of Mahomes. Dude would just sit in the pocket, dodge the pass rush, and then fire it in there to a WR. He might have been top 3 in navigating the pocket in the history of the NFL. He doesn't ever do that now. He just bails and runs and throws some crazy shit every single time. They need to make him stay in the pocket.
I agree dillphag. Certainly is a trust issue. LT has been bad but it isn't all on the LT. He's worried about taking a hit or getting stuck in no mans land. I honestly think if it is a playoff game he just steps up and takes hits if he has to. [Reply]
Seems like he knows we're playing with house money, and its all about survive and advance.
Even though he has a high INT:TD ratio this year, half the picks aren't really on the QB.
Feels like it's been super safe & conservative thus far, and it's worked. His missed passes are misses to safe spots instead of danger spots. Boundary balls, deep overthrows, or sky-high balls. Rarely is he throwing into contested space or putting the ball in danger.
It's put us in some shitty spots, but undefeated is undefeated.
Lastly, I agree that when we see the worst of Mahomes, it's either he's dicking around & being reckless (Not an issue this year), or he's so paranoid about bad OL (Tackle) play that he reverts into an average player (happening a lot this year). [Reply]
Originally Posted by Dante84:
Seems like he knows we're playing with house money, and its all about survive and advance.
Even though he has a high INT:TD ratio this year, half the picks aren't really on the QB.
Feels like it's been super safe & conservative thus far, and it's worked. His missed passes are misses to safe spots instead of danger spots. Boundary balls, deep overthrows, or sky-high balls. Rarely is he throwing into contested space or putting the ball in danger.
It's put us in some shitty spots, but undefeated is undefeated.
Lastly, I agree that when we see the worst of Mahomes, it's either he's dicking around & being reckless (Not an issue this year), or he's so paranoid about bad OL (Tackle) play that he reverts into an average player (happening a lot this year).
And he's not trusting his players to make plays. I mean, I get it; he threw a lot of passes to guys that were wide open last season, and they managed to eff it up anyway, several times resulting in picks. But to win at the highest level, to win in the playoffs and the SB, a QB needs to get the ball into the hands of his playmakers, which means trusting them to make plays even in tight window/contested ball situations. And for the last two seasons in particular, Pat hasn't been willing to trust his players (other than Travis) to make plays.
I said more than a season ago that Pat running as much as he was running was a bad sign. Well, we're watching the results now. [Reply]